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How We Overcome Self-Doubt with Dr. Tara Cousineau | Ep. 54

• Allison Lane • Episode 54

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Have you ever told yourself, “I’ll write my book when I feel ready” or “Who am I to write this?” If so, you’re not alone. High achievers often struggle with self-doubt, perfectionism, and the fear of putting their ideas into the world, especially when it comes to publishing a book.

Allison Lane sits down with Dr. Tara Cousineau, clinical psychologist and author of "The Perfectionist Dilemma," to discuss how perfectionism holds authors back and what you can do to finally take action. If you’ve been procrastinating on writing, launching, or marketing your book, this conversation will give you the mindset shifts you need.

Press play now and take the first step toward writing with confidence.

What You’ll Learn in This Episode:

  • The biggest mistakes high-achieving authors make when it comes to writing and publishing.
  • Why perfectionism sabotages book launches and how to break the cycle.
  • The mindset shift that will help you finally start (and finish) your book.

Resources Mentioned:

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 No matter how you're publishing, you need to launch your book like a pro. Join me 7-week guided program: Bestseller Launch School. Live trainings start April 30. Grab your seat NOW!  https://lanelit.com/bestseller  

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Dr. Tara:

We don't want to get rid of that striving for excellence. Like that's a really important value. It's important to feel like you're doing quality, meaningful work in the world. But you don't need to suffer as you do it.

Allison:

Welcome back to the Author's Edge. I am your host, Allison Lane, and I am here for you. I'm so glad you're showing up for yourself and making time to make yourself a better marketer for your own being and for the book that you meant to write 10 years ago, but you wrote now. Or the book that you are just starting to figure out what does it wanna be. Or if you're on your eighth book, it doesn't matter. We all need to be better marketers of ourselves and also the books we're writing. So, you're in the right place. Sit back wherever you are. Probably, in the target parking lot'cause that's where I listen to the podcast that have time to. And let me dive in because today I'm so happy to welcome Dr. Tara Cousineau to the show. She's a clinical psychologist, a meditation teacher. She is yogarefic. And she helps high achievers let go of perfectionism and step into the opportunity they have to do the thing that they always wanted to do, but with confidence and joy. Who doesn't want that? She's also a psychologist at Harvard's Counseling and mental health services. She's has her own private practice. Her new book also is the Perfectionist Dilemma. Learn the art of self-Compassion and become a happy achiever. This book is so good. You'll hear during the interview how it has changed me and what the changes I've made to even my schedule are. I can't wait to hear how you are changed. When you read it too, you'll see all the links for her book and the book she recommends and all the things we talk about in the show notes. But let's now dive in. Welcome, Dr. Tara Kusano. We're both in the afterglow of your book launch event at the Harvard bookstore called The Coop, which I thought was co-op, but then I got corrected by a client who's written 22 books, and he was like no, it's the Coop, Allison. And I was like, oh, okay. I'm so not an insider. But now I am. Now I'm in the inner circle. So, congratulations on your book launch of this amazing thing, the perfectionist dilemma. I keep telling you, how much you've helped me already, and this baby's only been out for a couple weeks. But the subtitle says it all to me, the learn the art of self-compassion and become a happy achiever. As a high achiever and a perfectionist myself. Like I do wanna still achieve, but I don't wanna feel the weight of the guilt of which I think we always do of but you didn't do all this other stuff. And that's what we focus on. And I wanna be able to celebrate everything that I am doing, but also that I want other people. So, for those listening in who are just as busy as you are with working full-time and serving patients, or teaching students, or cause listeners, I know that you're listening in the car on your way somewhere'cause you're trying to fit this in. I want to ask you Dr. Tara, about all those high achievers out there who are probably making some common mistakes when it comes to looking at their own success. So, let's just kick off by you helping us understand what are those common mistakes, and you can use me as an example if you want to.

Dr. Tara:

No. Okay. Thanks for having me, first of all. It's an excellent question to start with because I literally just had an hour consult with someone who has achieved a great deal in her young life, and I. said to her previously in the past, when you accomplish your degree, when that happens, savor it. Stay with it. Stay with it longer than you might because people who are high achieving. they reach this goal and then they're on to the next thing and they don't actually absorb or metabolize Or integrate

Allison:

just had this

Dr. Tara:

milestone.

Allison:

huge milestone

Dr. Tara:

And it makes me sad actually, is that they're not actually appreciating their own successes or their own, efforts. They're just on the next thing. And it's, a tricky part of the, of, I think of the mind that we get into that trap.

Allison:

I wanna just breathe through it.'cause I'm thinking we all do that, but why do we do that? Every woman I know is quick to say oh, thanks but what I really needed to do was this. Where does that come from? We can't even take a compliment.

Dr. Tara:

Exactly. I think that comes from conditioning. I think for girls and women, it's very much a How we need to continually prove ourselves over and over again in order to achieve some sort of status or ideal, Whether in a job partner looks, Appearance, friendships, where you live, And it's not our fault. It's not, this is for men too. If they're listening, it's not your fault. We are seeped in a culture, a stew of materialism and consumerism And the bars keep getting raised more and more to the clinic. What more can you do without getting worked out? And that's usually, it out.

Allison:

Yeah. They burn themselves out and then they have to take time because sometimes they're like, I'm just gonna take the weekend. Oh, go crazy.

Dr. Tara:

Right as at 48 hours is really yeah. lifetime.

Allison:

A lifetime, right. Or they have to take a step back'cause they're like, no, my health is suffering. But what I really see is women who are high achieving and men too. But high achieving, and they achieve the thing that they thought they always wanted. They're at the height of their industry or their field. And then not only have they achieved it, but then they fizzle out because then what? Like they've been a perfectionist their whole lives. They've been a high achieving. They've beat themself up. They haven't savored anything. They get to the top and they're like, it's not like WW, but it is what else is gonna drive you if there's nothing else to drive you? Because they've been letting external forces dictate what their success was. And we were talking about this a little offline last night after your book event. And I just find that resonating with me as somebody who reached heights and my first 25 years, or even my first 10 years I was, considered a rising star and then as, a superstar, then whatever. But I never celebrated it. I always thought, oh, I just, this is, I'm just a little me from rural Maryland with my Maryland accent. I can't even say rural. It's hard. But then we achieve these heights and particularly for writers who oftentimes they are at the top of their field, but they don't know the path to writing a book Because it wasn't part of their career path. So as I'm on this, campaign for everyone to think bigger about the ripple effect they can have in the world, I really want you to speak to the person who's achieve the thing they thought they would achieve, but they have more to give. So how do we unlock that?

Dr. Tara:

Unlocking is a good word.

Allison:

I think

Dr. Tara:

what happens, at least in my experience, with high achievers is we actually, our nervous systems to the constant achievement that we don't.

Allison:

Feels

Dr. Tara:

like

Allison:

to

Dr. Tara:

a pause or take a rest

Allison:

us,

Dr. Tara:

or savor, and we

Allison:

we actually disconnect

Dr. Tara:

sometimes from the feelings, from the

Allison:

from the feelings, from the meaning,

Dr. Tara:

the

Allison:

the purpose that got you started

Dr. Tara:

place.

Allison:

I always want

Dr. Tara:

people to

Allison:

to recognize that their

Dr. Tara:

their

Allison:

value has been in their effort

Dr. Tara:

all

Allison:

along and

Dr. Tara:

about what's on the outside, it's what's in the inside. And that gets obscured with being on this treadmill of succeeding.

Allison:

And when it comes to I easy for me to write books I really struggled with that.

Dr. Tara:

I didn't

Allison:

I didn't think I was good.

Dr. Tara:

did I think I Did what I have

Allison:

I have to,

Dr. Tara:

Did it

Allison:

did it even matter?

Dr. Tara:

Would I

Allison:

would I say that would be any different than somebody else who's in.

Dr. Tara:

Than the comparing mind settles in. And we can't help the comparing mind either because that's actually how our brain operates.

Allison:

But when we start to negatively compare ourselves to

Dr. Tara:

To ideals, who have made these,

Allison:

people's rights, life,

Dr. Tara:

We

Allison:

we actually,

Dr. Tara:

their

Allison:

their backstory, which is probably 20

Dr. Tara:

years of really hard work also. So

Allison:

so we forget that.

Dr. Tara:

things

Allison:

actually don't happen that there

Dr. Tara:

There are

Allison:

all these other

Dr. Tara:

out

Allison:

out there,

Dr. Tara:

we might

Allison:

we might be comparing ourselves to the wrong

Dr. Tara:

step.

Allison:

and the trajectory.

Dr. Tara:

like how

Allison:

Like how do you get started on something

Dr. Tara:

without

Allison:

being perfect, without it all figured out?

Dr. Tara:

And that actually

Allison:

Actually,

Dr. Tara:

is a practice of self-compassion. To go back to the

Allison:

SubT.

Dr. Tara:

of my book is you have to actually

Allison:

Really

Dr. Tara:

kind to

Allison:

to yourself along the way because you're doing something that might be new, might feel like

Dr. Tara:

imposter. Those

Allison:

are the thoughts

Dr. Tara:

that often

Allison:

arise,

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

to remind yourself that

Dr. Tara:

I'm actually doing something new.

Allison:

it's okay

Dr. Tara:

to be a beginner. And I think high achievers don't like being beginners.

Allison:

High achievers want to, they might be a beginner, but they want an a plus out of the gate. And they like all their ducks to be in a row as well. And so that's why we see procrast to learning And procrast them to get prepared, Which is the worst kind of preparing. I'm organizing so that I'll be organized when oh my God, let's just do it Lord have mercy. No and high achievers they oftentimes, they think that they have to earn the right to do the next thing is what I notice. This is what you'll have to talk me through this. But when they do breakout, unlock their imagined perceived next step of, I'm going to speak at a conference that's not an industry conference, but it's like a global conference. And they realize oh, this was available all along, but there's just no like hierarchical step to that. So, you really have to unlock your own potential. So that you can go for the thing that no one has invited you to. But the invitation is universal, it's ubiquitous, it's available to everyone. So like for you, I'm sure you have colleagues who have not written a book, you decided to write a book, so good on you. That's my point is you're an expert in your field. You are a psychologist at the Harvard counseling center and you have your own private practice and you wrote a book. Because you decided you were going to do that. You didn't wait for someone to say, you've achieved enough. It's now time. So I wanna help other people unlock that. Truth

Dr. Tara:

To

Allison:

to write my first book,

Dr. Tara:

book, which is a kindness I mean, it's not like a heavy topic, but I I had. important meaning behind it. That kind of got my butt in the chair actually, to Actually, writing. and that was that wasn't it actually wasn't about me that the book was actually a message For my daughters people in the community. So, I had to take myself, my ego outta it and remind myself I I have an opinion, I have a perspective, I have something share, and I'm just the channel for it. And there might be other people who have a message. they're the channel For their version of the message. But I have, version, so I had to flip the script Literally, clearly internally that it wasn't about am I gonna do this right? Is this even important? Who do I think I'm say wait minute. I have something that I wanna share And I made it personal in I wanted to leave something behind for my daughters. I thought, oh, drop dead tomorrow. Cheese. Okay. It's a good practice in mindfulness circles. It's actually a good practice This. moment, if this was your day, if this is your week, how would you spend your life? I'll tell you what? You wouldn't be looking at your to-do list. You would be connecting with people. You were to Appreciating people be You would be doing kind and generous acts. So I, my kids were in high school coming to the end of high school. It was a crazy busy time household. And I was like, okay, But the the world was mean.

Allison:

Daughter got beaten up

Dr. Tara:

There was like

Allison:

crazy.

Dr. Tara:

were happening. I was like, wait a minute, what happened to kindness? And that's what got my

Allison:

My first book started. I was like, I wanna look into this a little bit deeper.

Dr. Tara:

With the

Allison:

The perfectionist, the one that just came out.

Dr. Tara:

I I had been working with emerging adults, young people you

Allison:

Who

Dr. Tara:

have

Allison:

been

Dr. Tara:

high achievers,

Allison:

like

Dr. Tara:

for whatever, 18 years.

Allison:

18 years, and here they're,

Dr. Tara:

and

Allison:

and now they have all this

Dr. Tara:

syndrome happening and or really hard on themselves, like internalizing this constant message

Allison:

that you have to keep,

Dr. Tara:

W

Allison:

working hard.

Dr. Tara:

you have to

Allison:

You have to prove yourself constantly,

Dr. Tara:

which

Allison:

which is when I was like, I gotta actually do something.

Dr. Tara:

help

Allison:

help these people. Because I was actually in the same exact position when I was getting my PhD, and so I thought.

Dr. Tara:

okay. The The perfectionists have such great intentions.

Allison:

They

Dr. Tara:

wanna do good things in the world. They They wanna be be productive. There's some sense of, Really wonderful agency. And then they, up, yeah, like but that's the dilemma. And then they suffer. So So in all these wonderful things that. do and the new learning and making some wave in the world, they they beat themselves up along the way. Oh Oh my gosh, Can can you do that without the suffering? So So that was the impetus for the perfectionist alumni is that we don't want to get rid of that striving for excellence. Like that's a really important value. It's important to feel like you're doing quality, meaningful work in the world. But you don't need to suffer as you do it.

Allison:

I'm so moved by that. I feel like everyone needs to hear that feeling that you should have achieved something already is such a way to beat yourself up, especially when you have so much value to provide so much wisdom and kindness to pass on. And what I find about nonfiction authors is that they're driven to help. it's never, oh, I wanna put my stamp on the world like that. look at my fist. for those of you not watching on YouTube, put your stamp on the world looks like you're gonna punch the world that is not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about offering something with open hands, like you are offering knowledge and perspective and lessons and steps that people can interpret as their own. But Dr. Tara, if you hadn't written these two books, that would all still be in your noggin and only known by the people who see you professionally and by your peers. And it's too small of a circle. Expanding your ripple effect is what I'm talking about. the good, knock on effect that you can have is so much larger when you write a book. now let me ask this other question, which is about how in a world that glorifies hustle, culture, and perfection, which is just, anything I do the speed of light is actually not perfect. It's always messy and not great. But what is a big shift you've seen recently in the way that people approach their own mental health and growth in that type of, maybe it's a old, I don't know if it's an old perspective, but hustle or your side hustle or you've got to do something, but it has to be perfect out of the gate. Have you seen a shift? God, I hope you have. Please say yes. You know

Dr. Tara:

I'm I'm a yes And the

Allison:

oh.

Dr. Tara:

why I see the shift, there's no yes, but here, but,

Allison:

And the reason

Dr. Tara:

because

Allison:

because I'm in

Dr. Tara:

a

Allison:

almost a privileged

Dr. Tara:

situation of

Allison:

of being

Dr. Tara:

a

Allison:

a clinical psychologist,

Dr. Tara:

that

Allison:

people come to me because they've had this first step of self. Something has happened in their life where they

Dr. Tara:

recognize

Allison:

that

Dr. Tara:

they're,

Allison:

they

Dr. Tara:

need to

Allison:

to make a shift. They might not know.

Dr. Tara:

exactly, but they've had that awareness with high

Allison:

Achievers often,

Dr. Tara:

often, or, and with perfectionist in

Allison:

particularly

Dr. Tara:

That moment of

Allison:

that moment of self-awareness

Dr. Tara:

is

Allison:

is often

Dr. Tara:

because their

Allison:

their body shut down.

Dr. Tara:

They've gotten an illness.

Allison:

For me it was like,

Dr. Tara:

TMJI

Allison:

TMJ

Dr. Tara:

having,

Allison:

having

Dr. Tara:

I was having

Allison:

nerve pain in my

Dr. Tara:

I didn't know what,

Allison:

where that coming from?

Dr. Tara:

whatever, 32 years old, maybe at the

Allison:

Time.

Dr. Tara:

that couldn't

Allison:

tell it to myself, but my body did, and then I.

Dr. Tara:

out why. And the why was because I was on this sort of, that Brene Brown thing, like hustling for worthiness, right? That we

Allison:

Get on this treadmill

Dr. Tara:

of

Allison:

of doing and achieving,

Dr. Tara:

And then

Allison:

and then if we feel productive,

Dr. Tara:

it

Allison:

it means we're worthy.

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

And so

Dr. Tara:

we

Allison:

we have to notice that we've been on this

Dr. Tara:

pro

Allison:

productivity treadmill

Dr. Tara:

and

Allison:

and

Dr. Tara:

exhausted

Allison:

ourselves that we're

Dr. Tara:

enjoying what we're doing anymore.

Allison:

so that.

Dr. Tara:

all.

Allison:

Also when people

Dr. Tara:

when people

Allison:

come to me, they're like,

Dr. Tara:

don't

Allison:

I don't think I'm join this.

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

And that's a really important moment of recognition

Dr. Tara:

To

Allison:

start to make some shifts in,

Dr. Tara:

and they don't have to be huge ones. They can be small, consistent, subtle shifts to get back into some balance or maybe just cultivate balance for the first time in your life.

Allison:

yeah. Those small, what seems like a small shift. But I told you, and I keep telling people that I read your book and I was like, oh my gosh. I am always, no matter where I am, I'm always prepared to do two other things. If there's even a gap in my attention, like I've got podcasts queued up and I've got my laptop with me and my go Bagg, which, why do I need a Go Bagg? Allison. So you made me notice that I was go Gogo. And when I allowed myself time to drive around and not have a podcast on and actually enjoy the radio silence so that I was like, oh my gosh, I feel so much better. And I was able to observe that there were things on my to-do list that were never gonna get done that weren't interesting or important or urgent, and I could only do that once I gave myself space. Which I had to force myself to take my pile of sticky notes and write them all out in one notebook so I could see them all side by side.'cause I had been carrying around a stack of sticky notes that were all scribbled on for two months. Allison?

Dr. Tara:

so I

Allison:

I wonder,

Dr. Tara:

and we're not gonna do any

Allison:

any therapy, Come on, this is why I do this.

Dr. Tara:

my def, here's my definition of perfectionism. And

Allison:

And whether it's productivity or workaholism, you.

Dr. Tara:

you can give it whatever label you want, but the way that I have come around to defining perfectionism is that

Allison:

It's

Dr. Tara:

the

Allison:

the paradox

Dr. Tara:

created

Allison:

by the need for belonging or the converse,

Dr. Tara:

the

Allison:

the fear of rejection,

Dr. Tara:

paired with

Allison:

with unrealistic expectations for

Dr. Tara:

for

Allison:

achievement

Dr. Tara:

And approval

Allison:

and that,

Dr. Tara:

your energy or life force.

Allison:

yeah. That's what I'm hearing from you is that,

Dr. Tara:

that filling,

Allison:

that time gap

Dr. Tara:

with

Allison:

something to do

Dr. Tara:

is

Allison:

really

Dr. Tara:

the

Allison:

the way that your system,

Dr. Tara:

your

Allison:

mind, body, heart system is.

Dr. Tara:

is trying

Allison:

To

Dr. Tara:

make

Allison:

yourself

Dr. Tara:

feel. Important or

Allison:

or worthy or responsible.

Dr. Tara:

You've

Allison:

you've got Family to take care of

Dr. Tara:

and and at the same time, it's gonna stand up your energy life force. And people will

Allison:

will say that's, alright. That's a little bit out there.

Dr. Tara:

that's why

Allison:

why people come in. Because their

Dr. Tara:

their

Allison:

energy is gone.

Dr. Tara:

It's

Allison:

It's like

Dr. Tara:

they've

Allison:

they've just

Dr. Tara:

Burned the

Allison:

the candle at both ends, and

Dr. Tara:

that's that

Allison:

that awareness status.

Dr. Tara:

I'm burning the candle at both ends.

Allison:

This is just too hard. And now I wanna write a book.

Dr. Tara:

am?

Allison:

I'm because of? What happens is when you don't recognize you're having

Dr. Tara:

this

Allison:

this sort of experience of depletion is the inner

Dr. Tara:

critics will storm

Allison:

right? In with,

Dr. Tara:

with Yeah.

Allison:

yeah. Who do you think,

Dr. Tara:

you are

Allison:

And then we have to be really mindful

Dr. Tara:

that. We

Allison:

we have inner critic narratives

Dr. Tara:

that will

Allison:

will fill in the space

Dr. Tara:

and

Allison:

and then

Dr. Tara:

sabotage

Allison:

Yeah. That inner critic is something that I witness a lot in working with women particularly is that they know that other people see them as an expert. And then they finally find me and they say, am I crazy? is anyone even gonna be interested in this book idea? And you know what I always say is, first of all, you are a big effing deal. And if you are someone who has found this podcast, you also are a big effing deal. Because there are a ton of, you can find your inner writer podcasts and those have their place. But this podcast is about getting some poo done. And if you're writing nonfiction and you are an expert in your field and you feel called to write for sure you should be writing. But their first question is I feel like I should be doing this, but is anybody even gonna care because I'm not the expert. And they'll give me all the reasons why which is so sad, but they think that they're not the cat's pajamas and they are.

Dr. Tara:

But Allison, I was

Allison:

Was exactly in that situation

Dr. Tara:

in

Allison:

20 16, 20

Dr. Tara:

17

Allison:

that I didn't

Dr. Tara:

did I have enough experience

Allison:

college. And

Dr. Tara:

I

Allison:

I

Dr. Tara:

sitting

Allison:

with a

Dr. Tara:

colleague, I.

Allison:

for lunch one day and I said, this is my idea.

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

I

Dr. Tara:

almost

Allison:

what

Dr. Tara:

just said, am I crazy to think that I could

Allison:

actually

Dr. Tara:

write an

Allison:

an interesting book about kindness.

Dr. Tara:

isn't it just a no-brainer in life? And she just turned to me and she said, Tara, this is Your your

Allison:

story.

Dr. Tara:

It's

Allison:

It's your version

Dr. Tara:

It

Allison:

it matters.

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

And was that little,

Dr. Tara:

of

Allison:

of Yeah,

Dr. Tara:

version of

Allison:

it, that helped me kind

Dr. Tara:

get unlocked.

Allison:

Say something about

Dr. Tara:

this and

Allison:

this and it might seem

Dr. Tara:

but you know what, I bet there is some science about it.

Allison:

lemme go look into it. And that really helped

Dr. Tara:

shift

Allison:

things. That's what I tell people now. I mean there's, everyone's got a story

Dr. Tara:

of

Allison:

of all,

Dr. Tara:

and

Allison:

and many people will say, yeah, I should write book about this.

Dr. Tara:

I'm like. Why don't you like what

Allison:

What would stop you?

Dr. Tara:

And that's

Allison:

where

Dr. Tara:

the

Allison:

inner critics, I.

Dr. Tara:

interesting'cause I have identified inner critics, in my,

Allison:

And all the storytelling that

Dr. Tara:

I've

Allison:

I've heard from

Dr. Tara:

people

Allison:

sitting

Dr. Tara:

from me, there might be

Allison:

be inner judge, right?

Dr. Tara:

of you is who do you think you are? Or there

Allison:

might be the inner,

Dr. Tara:

that says, you

Allison:

you can't do this,

Dr. Tara:

not

Allison:

not

Dr. Tara:

it unless

Allison:

unless you're

Dr. Tara:

your ass

Allison:

off. This is never gonna happen.

Dr. Tara:

That harsh, inner bully.

Allison:

Or there might be

Dr. Tara:

The

Allison:

the doom, right? The detective who just has to research everything. You had mentioned that in the beginning the constant

Dr. Tara:

doing before you even get

Allison:

started

Dr. Tara:

Have,

Allison:

has to leave no stone unturned until you're ready. And

Dr. Tara:

the right there. I work with a lot of those people by the

Allison:

because they're researchers by nature and they can't help research, you know at some point,

Dr. Tara:

no more research,

Allison:

They research and then they need other people to validate because they're used to peer reviewed publications.

Dr. Tara:

There's a lot of

Allison:

Scrutiny. So they have to do everything right, very precise,

Dr. Tara:

and

Allison:

and so they have to keep going over things

Dr. Tara:

over and over

Allison:

over again.

Dr. Tara:

It

Allison:

It's wow,

Dr. Tara:

really a

Allison:

a challenge

Dr. Tara:

to

Allison:

to break out of that sort of internal algorithm

Dr. Tara:

that,

Allison:

gets just cultivated over time.

Dr. Tara:

And then

Allison:

And then there's the

Dr. Tara:

like the nitpicker that

Allison:

that up. Everything nice and neat like you were saying. Oh.

Dr. Tara:

notes and the post-it notes and getting organized. Like I definitely have a very loud inner nitpicker. And even today I was like, oh my gosh, I've got five hours of clients. I'm doing this podcast with Allison. My desk is a mess.

Allison:

mess.

Dr. Tara:

I

Allison:

I need to clean.

Dr. Tara:

and I'm not

Allison:

I'm not gonna feel

Dr. Tara:

clear

Allison:

or energetically available unless I do.

Dr. Tara:

I

Allison:

I just create more of a mess, actually what happens because, yeah. And then there's that

Dr. Tara:

one

Allison:

part that I think

Dr. Tara:

Is

Allison:

there for many high achievers, which is that

Dr. Tara:

which was

Allison:

named by

Dr. Tara:

a student of mine, her

Allison:

inner

Dr. Tara:

thief. And I told her I was adopting that as an archetype

Allison:

Oh yeah.

Dr. Tara:

people who

Allison:

who do not allow themselves

Dr. Tara:

to relax.

Allison:

rest,

Dr. Tara:

play. Find that

Allison:

that space

Dr. Tara:

where actually

Allison:

that space is the birth place and creativity.

Dr. Tara:

We

Allison:

We don't let ourselves to, you

Dr. Tara:

Give those little

Allison:

knows.

Dr. Tara:

that we

Allison:

So we

Dr. Tara:

to

Allison:

have to check ourselves

Dr. Tara:

and then not try to

Allison:

get rid of those parts.

Dr. Tara:

We have to

Allison:

I understand them. Yeah. Because the thing that you think is a no-brainer is mind blowing to everyone else. The thing you think is obvious at, just in general, if you are, if you're listening and you think, doesn't everybody know about kindness? doesn't everybody know about gratefulness? Doesn't everybody know about how to pitch their book? Which I thought as a career marketer and publicist, I'm like pitching any idea has to do with the receiver. Not the, isn't this a good idea, but what is the No, nobody knows the thing that you think is obvious. I'm just thinking of all the authors I work with, They're all asked the same questions. Isn't this obvious? Hasn't this been done before? No, it hasn't. It hasn't been done from your perspective by you in this time. Which is also different. Like the thing that you can't control is now versus a year ago. And nobody knows the book that you think is the end all be all book on the topic that you think that everyone, oh, everybody already has that book. I've never heard of that book and that's always the case. I love pointing out I've, never read Julia Cameron's book on, being a writer and going, Yeah. there are plenty of books that if you're an expert you think, oh, it's already been done. Because everybody knows that. No, they don't. There's always room in people's hearts. And also, even if they have, they do know about whatever the other book is that you as the author think is the thing, what if they don't connect with that author? Because it's not just the book, but they have to trust the voice that's providing it. Yeah.

Dr. Tara:

Yeah, I

Allison:

I always say,

Dr. Tara:

for everybody,

Allison:

You just have to find that somebody

Dr. Tara:

Is.

Allison:

So keep putting yourself out there because your story

Dr. Tara:

you tell it

Allison:

matters.

Dr. Tara:

energy and your, the love that you have to give the world

Allison:

Matters,

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

it's a big universe, mean there's 8 billion people in the world,

Dr. Tara:

is gonna be an audience for what you have to say. And

Allison:

and have to.

Dr. Tara:

myself

Allison:

this constantly, like

Dr. Tara:

I do not

Allison:

I do not have this down pat.

Dr. Tara:

So is

Allison:

this is why I go back to

Dr. Tara:

book

Allison:

book Infectious Dilemma

Dr. Tara:

Okay,

Allison:

I thought okay, people don't need a recipe for it.

Dr. Tara:

I

Allison:

I have this method, evolve

Dr. Tara:

really

Allison:

and it really begins actually with present to life

Dr. Tara:

because we

Allison:

because we get still hung up and.

Dr. Tara:

that we actually aren't present to our life

Allison:

To validate how we're feeling

Dr. Tara:

Because another thing that.

Allison:

the

Dr. Tara:

High

Allison:

achievers perfectionists who have like strong inner

Dr. Tara:

or

Allison:

or inner bullies, they

Dr. Tara:

are

Allison:

actually are so in control.

Dr. Tara:

allow themselves to feel.

Allison:

So sometimes I feel like, oh my gosh, we have to do

Dr. Tara:

training and empathy towards ourselves And then to

Allison:

To

Dr. Tara:

befriend

Allison:

those,

Dr. Tara:

that

Allison:

that imposter feelings, to befriend

Dr. Tara:

the

Allison:

the inner critics because

Dr. Tara:

there,

Allison:

there because

Dr. Tara:

they

Allison:

they're protecting

Dr. Tara:

you from some

Allison:

from some perceived danger.

Dr. Tara:

a threat

Allison:

Threaten world. You're

Dr. Tara:

that you're gonna

Allison:

gonna get exposed or

Dr. Tara:

in

Allison:

some way That comes from story long.

Dr. Tara:

Let's help

Allison:

Let's help that part. Heal,

Dr. Tara:

let's

Allison:

Let's help.

Dr. Tara:

up to say, no, you have arrived right now in this moment. So we really need to tend to those inner critical voices and not be mad at ourselves and

Allison:

and

Dr. Tara:

just,

Allison:

Just do it. Because if we could just do it,

Dr. Tara:

We

Allison:

we would,

Dr. Tara:

are

Allison:

yeah. Things that get in the way

Dr. Tara:

we need

Allison:

and we need to take that step back and create the space and community to allow

Dr. Tara:

yourself

Allison:

yourself

Dr. Tara:

grow and do these

Allison:

and these harder things

Dr. Tara:

And be a beginner, be glad to be a beginner in something new.

Allison:

I was gonna ask you that what's a popular tactic that doesn't work anymore, but I think you just hit it. It's the, just surround yourself with people who are doing it and you do it too, but that never works because somebody is always carrying that weight of I don't belong here. Or you do have to address the thing that's keeping you from enjoying the time or pursuing the goal. Mentality or no no pain, no gain or,

Dr. Tara:

grin and

Allison:

and bear, like

Dr. Tara:

those

Allison:

those sort of edicts that are in our culture

Dr. Tara:

are

Allison:

are really problematic. Because

Dr. Tara:

if

Allison:

if we could,

Dr. Tara:

we would,

Allison:

but we don't.

Dr. Tara:

because there's

Allison:

something else that's underneath the mindset, right?

Dr. Tara:

simply

Allison:

this mindset shift of

Dr. Tara:

scarcity to

Allison:

to.

Dr. Tara:

or

Allison:

Fix mindset to a growth mindset.

Dr. Tara:

You

Allison:

You really need to look at the block

Dr. Tara:

that's

Allison:

stopping you from doing something that

Dr. Tara:

you

Allison:

you understand like

Dr. Tara:

we are

Allison:

you're not done. Like we get it. Yeah, just do it. Just go, start that online.

Dr. Tara:

I've been saying to myself for a year, so that's my, just do it this year, but it's really hard, so I

Allison:

I need to understand

Dr. Tara:

like

Allison:

what's

Dr. Tara:

there

Allison:

the block there

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

and treat it kindly with curiosity and then figure out maybe what I need is community. Maybe what I need is help. Maybe

Dr. Tara:

It's

Allison:

it's not about just knowing how to do everything from the get go

Dr. Tara:

just dive

Allison:

dive right in

Dr. Tara:

without

Allison:

really having

Dr. Tara:

a

Allison:

a safety net for yourself.

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

And so that's where that self-compassion piece comes,

Dr. Tara:

in again, is like

Allison:

like self-compassion

Dr. Tara:

is

Allison:

your own safety net.

Dr. Tara:

for your really

Allison:

Protecting your inner work

Dr. Tara:

your

Allison:

inner sense of

Dr. Tara:

Self. And

Allison:

and we don't often give ourselves

Dr. Tara:

The

Allison:

safety net. And That comes in relationship.

Dr. Tara:

and those parts that are scared. Relationship with other people who may know just a little bit more than us, doesn't have to be the top expert in the world, but maybe someone who's 10% ahead of you. Talk to that person. Get that kind of support, which is what you provide actually in some of

Allison:

Actually

Dr. Tara:

your programs.

Allison:

program, right? It's intended because so many women I work with are like you. They're completely busy and they don't think they have time'cause they are not sure they're going to get a benefit out of something that they have to devote, an hour a month to. But because I am the glue in the next chapter Network, which is a network of high achieving women who are all doing the things, speakers, writers, media contributors, authors they're all doing. A profession as well. They're not just speakers, but they're speakers because they teach at the university or they're seeing patients or they're memoirs sharing a really important experience and insight. But if they're not together, they don't have, they don't have the opportunity for the unexpected learning and the. Unanticipated, surprise collaboration because the, and that's why I love. The the network is because when I see you, you folks together, I'm like, oh, I, you wouldn't even know to get introduced, but I've gotta make the introduction because there's something that's cool there, but it only takes a minute for me to say, Dr. Tara, you need to know, so and so because you're both, this interest in mind or you, but you wouldn't necessarily know that unless someone made the intro and you made time for it. I'm so glad, I'm so glad that we're talking about it.

Dr. Tara:

Yeah. I think,

Allison:

I think just

Dr. Tara:

thing about that piece

Allison:

that piece is

Dr. Tara:

you are

Allison:

what you were

Dr. Tara:

creating in your community and

Allison:

in your community and what women can find communities

Dr. Tara:

own

Allison:

in their own

Dr. Tara:

ways

Allison:

ways

Dr. Tara:

that

Allison:

is that

Dr. Tara:

you

Allison:

you can't learn

Dr. Tara:

or do something

Allison:

If you're playing

Dr. Tara:

you're playing safe.

Allison:

Right?

Dr. Tara:

But you

Allison:

But you also can't do

Dr. Tara:

it

Allison:

it if you're overwhelmed

Dr. Tara:

because

Allison:

because that shuts down

Dr. Tara:

Motivation, but if

Allison:

But if you can find places where you feel safely challenged, that's why I think the

Dr. Tara:

good

Allison:

good stuff happens

Dr. Tara:

is

Allison:

you have to feel safe enough and comfortable that

Dr. Tara:

You can take

Allison:

take those steps forward. You.

Dr. Tara:

It really, it's just like a toddler, right? Parents are gonna make sure that the glass coffee tables are covered and protected, but

Allison:

Let that child roam around, fall on his little, bottom and then stand back up. I, we all need to be safely challenged in those kind of days,

Dr. Tara:

And

Allison:

and that's, I think, where thriving really happens

Dr. Tara:

versus

Allison:

being in that survival mode.

Dr. Tara:

is overwhelm. When we're in overwhelm, we're pretty much

Allison:

Hustling

Dr. Tara:

We're in

Allison:

for in that survival zone. And we're

Dr. Tara:

thriving. And

Allison:

And when we're safe,

Dr. Tara:

we're too

Allison:

we're too complacent,

Dr. Tara:

right?

Allison:

We're in a more, maybe almost more avoidance

Dr. Tara:

that's

Allison:

that's not gonna get us any farther. So we have to find that sort of nice,

Dr. Tara:

A sort

Allison:

Sweet spot of being

Dr. Tara:

challenged. And I think writing

Allison:

are

Dr. Tara:

a

Allison:

complace to do that because

Dr. Tara:

other people

Allison:

who

Dr. Tara:

might

Allison:

might be at the beginning.

Dr. Tara:

they're a little bit farther than you, or they've already done one thing already, and then they

Allison:

You become this amazing resource

Dr. Tara:

for

Allison:

for you to sustain your own really internal motivation. There's always something I think good that can come out of community. But you have to show up for it. You have to make space for it,

Dr. Tara:

community. And

Allison:

and it does have to be the right,

Dr. Tara:

to do the little Goldilocks thing right? It's is this one right or is this one right?

Allison:

right. Because it's maternal feeling like

Dr. Tara:

ugh. It's like a

Allison:

it's a feeling of relief.

Dr. Tara:

this is the right place for me.

Allison:

Right. Dr. Tara, let me pivot and ask you for a book reco. What is a book that you wanna share today?

Dr. Tara:

oh my

Allison:

oh my gosh.

Dr. Tara:

past year I read a couple of really good books. I think my favorite one though is it's a book

Allison:

It's a book of fiction.

Dr. Tara:

called

Allison:

called Wayward, and it's spelled

Dr. Tara:

WEY. WARD, which actually has like a meaning, but you have to read the book for it. But it's by Amelia Hart.

Allison:

It's

Dr. Tara:

really

Allison:

kind

Dr. Tara:

Like witches in a way. Or, energy healers, that go back,

Allison:

you.

Dr. Tara:

a couple centuries and this sort of family line of having this gift of intuition and healing.

Allison:

That's the, that happens along the way.

Dr. Tara:

along the way.

Allison:

As I'm very interested in psychology, energy medicine, so I love any stories

Dr. Tara:

that

Allison:

that are about

Dr. Tara:

these unappreciated

Allison:

gifts of nature,

Dr. Tara:

especially for

Allison:

for women who are,

Dr. Tara:

are intuitive

Allison:

and.

Dr. Tara:

have these sort of intuitive powers of healing.

Allison:

It was a great read and it was first generation.

Dr. Tara:

I

Allison:

Oh, I'm gonna put the link in the show notes. This is my next read. I cannot wait.

Dr. Tara:

yeah I

Allison:

I love,

Dr. Tara:

know when the book came out, but I saw a description

Allison:

I think it was 2023.

Dr. Tara:

maybe.

Allison:

pretty recently.

Dr. Tara:

Yeah.

Allison:

It's a fun

Dr. Tara:

read and I really enjoyed it

Allison:

it and I read it. Wow. That's high praise.

Dr. Tara:

I know.

Allison:

Okay, we will put your book link in the show notes.

Dr. Tara:

Okay.

Allison:

in the show notes if you wanna join. We would love to have you. And before we call this podcast complete, Dr. Tara, what is one thing you wanna leave people with?

Dr. Tara:

I just wanna let

Allison:

I just wanna let people know that they're worthy of love and belonging and that their story matters

Dr. Tara:

we

Allison:

and we need to hear it

Dr. Tara:

hear

Allison:

hear it.

Dr. Tara:

are

Allison:

We're being

Dr. Tara:

So

Allison:

so please

Dr. Tara:

share your

Allison:

your stories.

Dr. Tara:

with the world.

Allison:

Oh, perfect. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And thank you, listener. Wherever you are sitting in carpool. I know you are.'cause that is my life too. We are so glad you're showing up for yourself and sharing this. Do your friends a solid. If this podcast, someone who needs to hear Dr. Tara's message, stop right now. Put your car in park. Make sure you're not gonna roll over a elementary school kid and share it. Just send it to someone who needs it, because the way that we can help people is to share what we know. Otherwise they're never gonna know, and you're never gonna remember later. So do it now. It helps people also find us when you leave a review, leave a five star review. It helps the algorithm and the infrastructure and the matrix. Show the podcast to people who need it. So thank you. I will see you next week.

People on this episode

Head Shot

Allison Lane

Host

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